Sometimes authors rewrite their books or create expanded versions of their books, so what do you do with your old book? This week, Mike and AJ answer that question and lay out all of the pros and cons of delisting your book. Mike has pondered the same question himself and shares his personal experience.
Sometimes authors rewrite their books or create expanded versions of their books, so what do you do with your old book? This week, Mike and AJ answer that question and lay out all of the pros and cons of delisting your book. Mike has pondered the same question himself and shares his personal experience.
Be sure to visit https://dwtbpodcast.com for more information and add your name to start receiving their newsletter. If you’d like to support this show, rate, subscribe, and leave a review on your podcast app.
Take Breaks Work Better, by John Briggs
Profit First for E-Commerce Sellers, by Cindy Thomason
Traction, by Gino Wickman
Not Your Sidekick, by CB Lee
AJ Harper, website
AJ’s Socials:
Mike Michalowicz, website
Mike’s Socials:
Episode 142:
“Should You De-list Your Book on Amazon?”
Mike Michalowicz:
Welcome back to the Don't Write That book podcast where you can learn how to write your
bestseller and own your authorship. Follow along with us as we give you an insider's view of the
book industry. Now, here are your hosts. Myself, Mike Michalowicz and AJ Harper.
Mike Michalowicz:
So I wanna kick off my first thanking Matt Robinson, who said this entire studio, he's sitting
right there right now. Um, he's smiling ear to ear, which took a long time for him to get to, uh,
because he's content with the audio quality. Um, it's a big deal. The, have you listened to these
episodes since we've been doing it with Matt? No. They are so superior. They are so excellent.
So, I just wanna invite our audience, if, if you're loving the production quality, would you please
give us a shout out and comment, particularly to Matt with one TMAT. Um, because I just
wanna acknowledge what everything, everything else Matt's done today we're gonna talk about.
Should you de-list your Amazon book? A really interesting thing. It came about from one of our
readers and actually a simplified author. So we'll talk about him and, uh, I'll read off his question
in just a second. I joined the studio with AJ Harper, my friend and co-writer of, did we do 10
books together? I mean, 10 titles. I think it's nine.
AJ Harper:
Well, it's 12 books.
Mike Michalowicz:
12 books. 10 titles. Yeah. Yeah.
AJ Harper:
Because two, we had, we did twice
Mike Michalowicz:
Clockwork and Rev, uh, is revised and expanded, and so is Profit First. Um, what do I admire
about you? I'm trying to think of something that's kind of atypical. Greeley,
AJ Harper:
You admire me because of my dog.
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Mike Michalowicz:
Yeah. Because I think a, a dog's behavior is also indicative of an owner's behavior. And there's
some dogs that are uncontrollable. Mm. And I think the owner justifies that. I think there's some
dogs who are, um, skittish and then the behavior is an aggression. I think that's also indicative of
the owner. And there's some dogs that just love on you. And I think that's indicative of the
owner. And that's what Greeley's like. Yeah. Why am I Greeley the most beautiful slobbery,
gentle loving dog. Yes. And I was like, oh, that's representative of you and Polly, your wife. It
it's representative of the owners. That's what I love about you.
AJ Harper:
Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. You know, he is a fixture. If you, if you're ever in a sprint or
you come to one of my events, he's often sitting right behind me looking out the window. Hmm.
Yeah.
Mike Michalowicz:
Yeah, yeah. And you're, you're, you had a prior dog. I don't recall the, we've had a lot of dogs.
Yeah. But recently, I remember your dog was walking. You had a ramp going up and down your
steps at your home, if I remember correctly. We
AJ Harper:
Did not. But you probably thought we should have had one.
Mike Michalowicz:
He was struggling to get up and down the steps or something.
AJ Harper:
Oh, yeah. We had, we, it was 'cause he's blind.
Mike Michalowicz:
That's what, that's right. That's right. Yeah. What was it? What was that dog?
AJ Harper:
The ramp wouldn't have helped too much.
Mike Michalowicz:
What was that dog's name?
AJ Harper:
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That was Nico.
Mike Michalowicz:
Nico,
AJ Harper:
Yeah.
Mike Michalowicz:
Okay. I never met Nico in person.
AJ Harper:
No.
Mike Michalowicz:
But Greeley, we basically shared a bed. <laugh>. Yeah.
AJ Harper:
Pretty much. That sounds right. Um, I, I admire your, uh, this is gonna sound funny, but, um,
when I came in today, I was so taken aback by how perfect your yard is. Oh, thank you. So I
admire you're doing that, right? Like, that's you,
Mike Michalowicz:
Me and my wife. Yeah. So
AJ Harper:
That's amazing. 'cause it looks like a professionally, like you have land, a whole team of
landscapers. It does look like a park. Yeah. And I was looking at, you have this, these two, um,
bird houses up on the trees. Yes. And they're just perfect the way that they're positioned. Yeah,
yeah. Yeah. How do you get anything in? You don't put anything in that. What do you mean? Do
you put bird feed in there?
Mike Michalowicz:
Oh, no, no, no. Oh no. You
AJ Harper:
Do
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Mike Michalowicz:
So high. You put a, it's a bird house. So you put I know you put a bird, so Yeah, I climbed the
ladder. Put it up there.
AJ Harper:
You climb the ladder to put bird seed in there. No,
Mike Michalowicz:
You don't put bird seed in a bird house, so, oh, it's not, it's not a bird feeder. It's a bird house.
AJ Harper:
Oh. It's just a bird house. But some bird houses, you can have feeders in them. So that's what I
was thinking.
Mike Michalowicz:
Oh, I guess you can, yeah. So these bird houses get occupied by Yes. The bird bird de jour.
AJ Harper:
Do you have a bird feeder?
Mike Michalowicz:
No, because the squirrels are just crazy about it. Yeah. No, we don't. But we will throw out bird
seed occasionally.
AJ Harper:
It's very beautiful.
Mike Michalowicz:
Thank you. We're very proud of it. And, and where you parked? There's a little parking spot
there. You may have noticed hanging off the trees. Are these crystal balls? So I came home from
travels recording and becoming self-made as an la This this podcast is so fun and so cool. And I
get back and, uh, it's, it's dusk. And all of a sudden I, I'm driving down the driveway and there's
these balls hanging from the tree. I'm like, oh, are beautiful. Kind of like ornamental Christmas
balls. And then all of a sudden, bink, they start lighting up. So Chris got these little solar, solar
based crystal balls. And it, it gives it this sense of like, I'm like, arrived at like a wedding or
something.
AJ Harper:
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Aw, sweet.
Mike Michalowicz:
I love it. Today's, uh, episode sponsored by Simplified. That's an imprint of page two. Page two
has been such an extraordinary experience for me, including how they just love on, like Greeley
loves on guests. Page Two loves on their authors. They do the exact same way they do. They're
absolutely remarkable. Michael Bunge Sandier has surpassed over 2 million books sold. He is an
author with page two, the Coaching Habit. Um, we've surpassed over 10,000 units for the money
habit and growing. Um, just proud of how they support authors at all different stages and ages.
You ready for the question that came from John Briggs? I'm ready. Okay. So John Briggs, he is
also an author with Page Two. Simplified and he sent a question. He said, um, I, I take it back.
This is my response. So John asked, should I de-list my book? And I respond.
Mike Michalowicz:
I said, well, a few things happen when you do this. Now let, let's talk about the impetus behind
this. He's coming out a new book called Take Breaks Work Better. Yes. He's a preexisting book
called The 3.3 Rule. And that's his system he developed that's being enhanced and translated into
the new book. Yes. So he said, should I delist the 3.3 rule? And I said, well, a few things happen.
You lose the reviews that's of your existing book, the 3.3 rule. You lose the opportunity to do the
newer edition available link if the book is no longer there, which I have on my books. Um, none
of those matter much in low volume sales, though. You can have ghost books selling, meaning
third parties can sell your books and have no control over that. So the listing stays up anyway. So
I wanna give you a little context of, this was a text response, so it's a little bit choppy.
Mike Michalowicz:
So he's thinking about removing his book, the 3.3 rule, so that he can put emphasis on his new
book. He wants to sell more of his new book. So I said there's pros and cons. One of the the cons
is any reviews you've accumulated don't go to your new book. Clockwork, which we've retained
the original. So there's a revised and expanded. But the original, the original has, I wanna say a
thousand reviews or near a thousand reviews. The new book has say 200 reviews. Well, a 1200
review book, the combined is much more impactful on the first kind of sniff test of a book than
200 reviews. Yeah.
Mike Michalowicz:
So those will be lost. Um, because they don't translate over. If you look at Clockwork, the
original edition, it says there's a new edition available. So if people come across your book that's
had, um, historical reviews and, and it's getting traction, people will see that and say, oh, I can
get the updated version. So when they see it, it only only has 200 reviews. It's not negatively
impactful. They say, oh, this is a continuation or expansion of the book. But the other thing that
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happened is they call 'em ghost books as people could purchase your book instead of garage
selling it. 'cause sell it back on Amazon and it comes re-listed. So even if you de de-list your
book, if someone tries to sell that book, the ISBN does not go away. No. It gets re-listed. Well,
AJ Harper:
I don't think it ever disappears.
Mike Michalowicz:
The ISBN never disappears.
AJ Harper:
No, not the ISBN, the listing. I think it just list says if it's totally gone, it's just unavailable.
Mike Michalowicz:
It says currently unavailable. Yeah. That that's right. That's exactly what it's, it says currently
unavailable so it doesn't fully go away. Um, how would you respond to John if, if you were
talking with him directly? Uh,
AJ Harper:
I would, I would've said you should probably de-list it.
Mike Michalowicz:
And why? What would be your reason for that?
AJ Harper:
Well, just not to confuse things. Yeah. Because it's, the new book is a different version of that
book. Right. It's not like, I mean, you don't have the piggy bank book. The one the original profit
First up.
Mike Michalowicz:
He still is. It is.
AJ Harper:
How come I never see it?
Mike Michalowicz:
Because the new book has such authority and there's derivative books. So if you type in Profit
First in the listings that you'll see naturally come down, you'll see the new Revising fan. But
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you'll see Profit First for Gyms Profit First. And then you'll see if you go a couple pages down,
you'll see the feedback. Right.
AJ Harper:
But that's just the Amazon.
Mike Michalowicz:
It's Amazon. Yeah.
AJ Harper:
That's nice. You or you pulled it
Mike Michalowicz:
From where,
AJ Harper:
I mean, you had an Amazon Advantage account, didn't you? Stop?
Mike Michalowicz:
We stopped shipping it. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, I'm saying you still see it. It's
still up there. Well, you can't buy it from us anymore. Right?
AJ Harper:
Yeah. But it's, The 3.3 Rule is still gonna be online.
Mike Michalowicz:
Yeah. You can, you can't erase it fully,
AJ Harper:
Fully. But it's not a profit first book, so It's probably gonna disappear.
Mike Michalowicz:
It'll fade out. Yeah. Fade out. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. So you would tell 'em to de-list it. Is there,
AJ Harper:
I think I would feel differently about it if it was a, if it was on a Profit First level, honestly.
Because there's a lot of good things about that book. I love that book actually. Yeah, me too.
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And, um, do you know this, do you know that he wasn't gonna, that wasn't even gonna be a book
and now it's another book? What? Or do you know it wasn't even gonna be a book? No. What?
Okay. So first of all, after John wrote Profit First for Micro Gyms, which John's an alum of my
workshop and he is in my author community. So he said, I'm never writing another book again.
And then he came, um, we do live edit every Thursday and he's in our, he's part of our collective.
So he said, I wanna bring something to you. I really just wanna do something for the accounting
community, more like a manifesto. And I wanna just distribute it to the accounting community.
'cause he is really about change. He wanted to change the industry. And which he, that he says
works unconscionable hours. Those are his, yeah. His favorite word. He loves unconscionable.
Yeah,
Mike Michalowicz:
Yeah. Yeah. I was busing he chop about that by the way. He uses so many times his book. I'm
like, it's unconscionable how many times you've used it.
AJ Harper:
Well, obviously, and I am saying it now. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. So anyway, he comes to
live edit and I did the Thing I do, which is John. Yeah. It's, it's a book. Yeah. Like maybe it's not
like who else has unconscionable hours? Yeah. A lot of industries, not just accountants and you
could really be helping et cetera. And he was kind of like, you know I could tell he was resigned.
Not exactly thrilled that he was gonna write another book. And he actually wrote in The 3.3 Rule
how he really wasn't gonna write another book. But, uh, he did. He knew. I mean, I definitely
nudged him in that direction. Yeah. So that book wasn't even supposed to be a book. And now
not only is it a book, but now it's gonna be an even better book. What is it? Work Less.
Mike Michalowicz:
Yeah. W take Breaks. Take Breaks,
AJ Harper:
Work, work Better. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. I just wanted to tell that story because it's humorous to me
that this has become two books, not just, and it was just supposed to be Isn't
Mike Michalowicz:
That funny? Yeah. Yeah. That's how it is for many authors. I remember Cindy Thomason who
wrote, um, uh, Profit First for E-Commerce. And so,
AJ Harper:
Which is a huge bestseller.
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Mike Michalowicz:
Is huge bestseller. So these authors are referring to, um, dip Their Feet in the Water of
Authorship, if you will, by writing a derivative Pro. Yes. First in our community. And the
overarching theme is, this is exhausting. I'll never do it again. And then the bug sets in, they're
like, yeah, I have to do this. So she wrote, um, Motherhood, Apple... Motherhood, apple Pie.
AJ Harper:
Apple Pie. Pie and all that Happy Horse Shit.
Mike Michalowicz:
Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's her book.
AJ Harper:
She's also in my community.
Mike Michalowicz:
She's amazing.
AJ Harper:
I'm waiting for her to figure out what she wants to do next.
Mike Michalowicz:
You know, one of the considerations if we have a book that we're going to delist is the inventory
we already have. Yep. What do you, what would you do with it? Or do you have ideas or
suggestions?
AJ Harper:
I mean, I would maybe bundle it for offers, you know, if pure people who would want the
original, if there was something that you, because again, that's a great book. So Yeah. You know,
there's some people who might be super into it and want it.
Mike Michalowicz:
Yeah. If you're de-listing a crappy, crappy book, maybe you should put that in the Pulp
AJ Harper:
Pulp it.
Mike Michalowicz:
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Pulp it. But if you're de-listing a book, because there's something that's gonna supersede it, but
the original book is the best of you. You can still get it out there. Yeah. Um, I've been at
speaking events where people, uh, offer books in the back of the room and I've seen 'em put their
historical, I call 'em historical books. <laugh>, I seem have backlist. Backlist. Yeah. But well, a
backlist. Yeah. I see it differently. 'cause a backlist is something that's still in the marketplace. I
see. This is not, their front list means it's not actively their current book. It's
AJ Harper:
Still backlist.
Mike Michalowicz:
Yeah. I call it you wrote it. No, but these are books that are not available anywhere. They're just
trying to deplete the inventory. That's why
AJ Harper:
I understand. Yeah. It's technically still
Mike Michalowicz:
It. A hundred percent is Yes.
AJ Harper:
He could do that.
Mike Michalowicz:
Yeah. Yeah. Are there situations where even if it's a great book, it could harm you by retaining a
book that you don't choose not to delist?
AJ Harper:
Yeah. I mean, if it's, um, it needs, really needs to be updated if there's something offensive
content in it, if it's gonna, um, if you've, if it's gonna harm your brand in some way, the content
within, maybe things have shifted. Maybe there's, maybe you were aligned with someone that
had a fall from Grace. You know, these are all examples. It's not gonna be helpful to you
anymore.
Mike Michalowicz:
You mentioned in here that Kindle buyers will retain what they've purchased. It doesn't
disappear. It doesn't get replaced. Uh uh <laugh>. So once they got it, they got it.
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AJ Harper:
They got it. It's theirs. This
Mike Michalowicz:
This is true for physical image too.
AJ Harper:
Yes. That's the, that's the logic there. So you might think, oh, I'm gonna take my Kindle down. It
doesn't change anything for anyone. It doesn't change access to the exist to the people who
already bought the Kindle.
Mike Michalowicz:
What about the SEO wins and gains you've made? If people search for John Briggs on Google or
on search and you, you, you are finding The 3.3 rule. Yeah. If you delist it, I wonder if it's gonna
compromise or confuse.
AJ Harper:
I think that could happen. And also there, you know, there's another thing which is even if, if you
look and see, okay, John has three books, not two, it, there's a different cachet there. Oh, this
author, this multi-book author. Yeah.
Mike Michalowicz:
Yeah. So there's there's reasons. There's reasons to keep it too.
AJ Harper:
Yeah.
Mike Michalowicz:
Um, say he, John does decide to keep it, are, are there any cons are so significant? Like, dude,
you are really compromising yourself. I mean, if you have a really bad book out there, get it
outta the market,
AJ Harper:
Uh, for his book. I don't, I don't, I mean, I, I think so. I don't think, I think it's fine either way.
Whatever choice he makes, I would probably take it down. Just because, just to keep things
simple. But there's a lot of merits.
Mike Michalowicz:
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Yeah. Yeah. And I wonder if you could even go back to the 3.3 rule and refresh it after tape
breaks work better comes out as the guidebook. It reminds me a little bit of Gino Wickman who
wrote Traction, and he has a book called the e, just EOS, which is Entrepreneur's Operating
System. Yeah. Which is a, is the core system of traction. So it's a supplemental book that digs
deeper into the core system. Yeah.
AJ Harper:
That's definitely the case with the 3.3 rule. It's, it's more detailed. Yeah.
Mike Michalowicz:
'cause Take breaks work better is gonna be a little more about the philosophy. It has the structure
and system in there. But the 3.3 rule is exact execution. Yes. And it, it will be in, take breaks
work better. But I wonder if this could be the technical supplement.
AJ Harper:
Maybe. Maybe he should keep it, maybe it the technical part. You know what I, okay, let's let's
talk about what if he keeps it Yeah. Yeah. So he should change the listing.
Mike Michalowicz:
How
AJ Harper:
So that when it, at the top it says the, um, you know, the detail, the this is a, a prequel Yeah. To
take breaks work better. Yeah. And, um, it's, it's supplemental. Start with take breaks work better.
Yeah. This is next. Yeah. He could just put that right in because he's self-published so he could
put that right in the listing. Yeah. He could also change the ebook to say that. And he could have
an ad for Take Breaks Work Better with the link that goes right to it. And he could actually put
the ad in the beginning of the ebook version of, of the 3.3 rule. Oh, that's
Mike Michalowicz:
Interesting.
AJ Harper:
And then it would say, Hey, I see you bought the 3.3 rule since I wrote this. I expand. I, right.
Yeah. So actually I would love it if you would please go get, take, break,
Mike Michalowicz:
Take breaks,
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AJ Harper:
Work better, take breaks, work better. You might even have him do a code that says, here's a free
code. You know, go to get the ebook version. Oh,
Mike Michalowicz:
That's interesting. Right. You buy the 3.3 rule. Yeah. And you can get the take breaks work
better book for
AJ Harper:
Free. And I would normally put an ad like that in the back. But I would do that one in the front.
And you could do a similar thing on his, you, you know, it does, I don't know if he has a plus
content on the 3.3 rule, but if he doesn't, or even if he does, I would change the a plus content.
Mike Michalowicz:
Oh, right. And yeah, that's right. So just for our audience, A plus content Exactly. Is what on
Amazon?
AJ Harper:
It's the, it's the graphics on the listing that, you know, usually go has, um, maybe it has highlights
from the book, maybe it has endorsements or other things. So it's the, it's the graphic depiction of
the essence of the book or why you should get it.
Mike Michalowicz:
And usually the chapter sample. So you can start scrolling through a book and read the first like
five pages
AJ Harper:
That's different than a plus content. Oh,
Mike Michalowicz:
That's different. Okay.
AJ Harper:
A plus content are the, the graphics on the listing. On the listing page.
Mike Michalowicz:
Oh, right. But where, where is it? Where it says like, scroll through page 1, 2, 3.
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AJ Harper:
There's a chapter sample. Which--
Mike Michalowicz:
Chapter sample. Yeah, I That's okay. I'm sorry. I was conflating the two. I thought that's what
you're referring to. Could he update his chapter sample? Well,
AJ Harper:
All he would have to do is put that, um, put something right at the beginning. 'cause the chapter
sample is always from the beginning. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So all he would have to do is put some
text there and an ad and then, but I would change the a plus content too to say, you know Yeah.
To mention that. So that could actually work to his advantage.
Mike Michalowicz:
Yeah.
AJ Harper:
And then it looks like a mo a more of a body of work as opposed to just a couple books. Yeah. I
mean, Knuck of a couple books is great, but I'm just saying there is, he does have a body of
work. Yeah.
Mike Michalowicz:
I, I think it's interesting. I also, I I would look at the performance of the existing book. So if the
book is selling one copy a week or one copy a month, meaning it's not selling aggressively the
effort to delist it, the public domain may have kind of delisted you already and you're making an
unnecessary effort.
AJ Harper:
However, work less,
Mike Michalowicz:
What is it? Take breaks. Work pattern, take breaks.
AJ Harper:
I keep getting wrong. I'm sorry, John. I'm sorry John. I love John so much. Um, take breaks,
work better is gonna sell really well. That means he's gonna probably sell the 3.3 rule.
Mike Michalowicz:
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That's true. He's probably gonna have an uptick in it. So then if you don't have a de-listed and
you have an uptick in your existing book, you have to prepare accordingly. The inventory and all
those different elements.
AJ Harper:
Yeah.
Mike Michalowicz:
Oh, that's fascinating. But if you delist it, demand may happen anyway. Um, but you're not
supplying it. It's a little bit of a conundrum. Yeah.
AJ Harper:
Maybe he should keep it. I'm a little And use it as a marketing tool to, to, to drive people to,
because people will look at it outta curiosity.
Mike Michalowicz:
Yeah. Okay. So we'll give our final verdict in a second. You had a story here about the NYS fifth
anniversary edition.
AJ Harper:
Okay. So when I had my publishing house, which again, that was fiction, we had, uh, probably
our most successful book is a book called Not Your Sidekick, by CB Lee, which was one mega
award winner, lamb literary award, um, is a big deal book. It's a great book. Also insanely good
cover. And we did a fifth anniversary edition and we made some changes. We had some extra
cool graphics inside the book. We had character profiles, we had some stuff in there. So it was
technically a new edition, meaning there was additional content in there. It wasn't just the same
book. And we had this whole drama because we just wanted the fifth anniversary edition to be
the one. Yeah. We wanted to swap it so that you weren't the old one, you weren't getting
anymore, you were just gonna automatically get the fifth anniversary edition. But we ran into all
this drama because they, we were told you, you have to get and swap this, and you're in, in a new
listing, and you're gonna lose, you're gonna lose everything you already had because the book
was different enough. It was essentially the same book, but we gave all this extra cool stuff in
honor of the fifth anniversary. And so ultimately we ended up not being able to do that with the
fifth anniversary. Oh,
Mike Michalowicz:
That's so fascinating.
AJ Harper:
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Because we didn't wanna lose the reviews.
Mike Michalowicz:
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Right. Exactly.
AJ Harper:
Yeah. 'cause it was such, it was such a big hit. Have you
Mike Michalowicz:
Noticed, is it harder to get reviews now? It seems like I'm getting less volume of new reviews
than historically. And I'm referring to Becca a year ago. Uh, and I'm thinking specifically again,
profit first. It was getting a review a day and now a new review, maybe once, uh, a week or two.
And it doesn't seem like there's a correlative effect between reader volume. Like there's not less
readers or new readers. Um, the email communication is the same level. So I'm just wondering,
have you seen that or is that my, just,
AJ Harper:
I'm maybe in your w the way the, maybe with a book like yours, I can see that happening. I'm
usually focused on helping authors get as many reviews as possible. Yeah. So I'm using all these
strategies. So those are still working and it they work. Yeah. Yeah.
Mike Michalowicz:
Okay.
AJ Harper:
Hey. But it might just, it might just be that, um, you need to switch some strategies
Mike Michalowicz:
Maybe. Yeah. It just feels to me like reviews are such a precious component. I think it's the first
blush test when I look at a book, my consumption is, if it has less than a hundred views reviews,
I'm like, okay, this book isn't established enough. It's probably their friends. Uh, if it has between
105 hundred, I'm like, okay, now it's getting legit momentum, but there's a certain number, it can
be thousands or tens of thousands. I'm like, this book is in the purview of the globe. Yeah. I have
to buy it. Um, so I think reviews have a lot of value. They
AJ Harper:
Do.
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Mike Michalowicz:
Uh, and it would be, it's stink to lose it. So what's your final verdict for John? Uh, de-list? List?
AJ Harper:
I think I changed my mind because when you, you're
Mike Michalowicz:
Not saying de-list, you're
AJ Harper:
Saying re-list. When you text, when you texted me, I, I immediately said, oh, tell him to de-list
it. Because in my mind I'm thinking, honestly, I was thinking about John. He's so busy. Yeah.
And he's the one mess around. Yeah. You know what I mean? Yeah. But now I'm thinking if it
could be just on autopilot where it, if he just made a few tweaks so that it's driving people to the
other book. Yeah. It could actually be in his favor.
Mike Michalowicz:
Yeah. Yeah. I, I'm with you. I try to give him both perspectives. I, I wouldn't, I wouldn't elicit
either. I wouldn't take activities to further promote it. I would put all my promotional energy
behind, take breaks, work better. Um, and I don't think the three three rule, it will get a little
bump when take breaks takes off. But I don't think he has to put more effort behind.
AJ Harper:
No, I don't think he needs, I think part of the reason he might wanna delist it is because he
doesn't wanna deal with the distribution.
Mike Michalowicz:
E Exactly. It's a self part. It
AJ Harper:
Is it, well, it's also become a, you know what show. Yeah. With Amazon Advantage.
Mike Michalowicz:
You don't use that word either. The S word,
AJ Harper:
I use it all the time, but with is a family show. And
17
Mike Michalowicz:
You send this episode already. Well, Cy, you referred to Cindy's book. You said the, you said the
S word.
AJ Harper:
It's in the title.
Mike Michalowicz:
<laugh>. I know <laugh>. Um,
AJ Harper:
Actually I use the H word. It's H word.
Mike Michalowicz:
That's, uh, it is an H word. Right. Because it is one word.
AJ Harper:
It's one word,
Mike Michalowicz:
Dude. Oh, nice. Nice. Um, anything else for John? Other tips?
AJ Harper:
No, but ultimately John, do what you want. <laugh> <laugh> do whatever you want. Pros and
cons have been laid out for you. You are gonna have to send this to him, the raw on this, because
it doesn't air until July or August. So he's gonna have already made his decision. He
Mike Michalowicz:
Will have,
AJ Harper:
You're gonna have to just say, here's the raw audio on this.
Mike Michalowicz:
Before I talk about what next week's episode is, um, I wanna talk about your work. Okay. Okay.
So the first thing I want to invite all of our audiences to get your book right. I must read it. Is the
authoritative book. I say every single episode You do.
18
AJ Harper:
We
Mike Michalowicz:
Have to say it over and over again. 'cause I don't know where people are joining us in this
journey. Okay. Fair. And so I want them to hear, and I also know people have heard this a
million times and the people who've heard a million times and have not got the book, shame on
you. The people who have
AJ Harper:
Not shame.
Mike Michalowicz:
Well, because it is that good. And the people who have heard it and have read the book, they get
why I'm saying it over and over. Okay. There's no question about, okay. Okay. Um, tell me about
your, of all the workshops and all the programs you have, what's your favorite to teach or lead?
Oh,
AJ Harper:
No.
Mike Michalowicz:
I know you like 'em all, but right now just the one comes to mind like, oh, this one's really gets
me hyped up.
AJ Harper:
Um, well probably workshop.
Mike Michalowicz:
Okay. And why is workshop get you excited?
AJ Harper:
Because the transformation is astonishing to see when authors come in at the beginning, it's 14
weeks, there's only 15 students. Yeah. Sometimes I take a a few more, but it's never gonna be
more than say 18 or 20. Yeah. To see that how they are on day one and how changed they are by
the end of it, and how much progress they've made and what they understand, what they know to
do now. Yeah. The new skills, awareness and confidence they have plus the amount of their
book that they have done. Um, yeah.
19
Mike Michalowicz:
Just, yeah. It's a transformation in people
AJ Harper:
And it's just magic. And it's, it's a hardcore 14 weeks maybe I'm saying that because it's on my
brain right now.
Mike Michalowicz:
Uh, I'm sure it is. Yeah. I'm not saying it's your favorite forever. Yeah.
AJ Harper:
It's, no, I love it. August, it's when Next one starts August 17th. So when this airs it's possible
there's a spot, but I don't know
Mike Michalowicz:
How does someone get their spot or check to see if they can,
AJ Harper:
They go to AJ Harper.com, see if it's, see if you wanna make the investment, if it looks, looks
right for you. And then you email laura@ajharper.com to get a, a meeting with me because we
like to have, I like to have a chat with you to see if it's really gonna be a good fit.
Mike Michalowicz:
That's awesome. Yeah. Next week we're gonna talk about how to choose between publishers.
Gimme a little context around what that's all about.
AJ Harper:
I had Patti Ann Talbot, who's one of my alums of my workshop, and in my community say, what
if I have multiple o offers from publishers? How do I choose?
Mike Michalowicz:
Okay, so this is not formats, this is not traditional versus hybrid. No, this is, you have multiple
author from hybrid or traditional. Yeah.
AJ Harper:
Oh, we've never talked about that.
Mike Michalowicz:
20
No. And uh, I was just talking to author actually. It's Tiffany Aliche. We filmed in here. We
filmed in here and we were talking about it. And, uh, she's very open about the offers she got and
what, what she decided, which was pretty fascinating.
AJ Harper:
Oh, Interesting.
Mike Michalowicz:
So maybe I can reveal some of that. Um, okay. I think we're good. We're good. Okay. Go to dw
tb podcast.com. That's our website. We have tons of free materials all prepared by you, aj. So
thank you for doing that. Um, and you'll see some of the stuff that aj, um, has available for you
and it's totally free. Also email at hello@dwtbpodcast.com. Tell us what you want us to talk
about. Um, if we made an error correction, you wanna send it our way, we will post that. And,
uh, you can also inquire about the work we're doing at Simplified that is the sponsor of this, this
episode, which is page two simplified. And the last and final thing. Do you wanna say it this
time? I always say it. Do you wanna say it?
AJ Harper:
Don't write that book. Write the greatest book. You can.